Roberto Germán [00:00:01]:
Welcome to Our Classroom. In this space, we talk about education, which is inclusive of, but not limited to, what happens in schools. Education is taking place whenever and wherever we are willing to learn. I am your host, Roberto Germán, and Our Classroom is officially in session. Lee and Low is the largest and most trusted multicultural children's book publisher in the US. A family run, independent and certified 100% minority owned business enterprise, Lee and Low produces high quality books about everyone for everyone, along with free educator resources to make meaningful use of each book in today's classroom. Email [email protected] today to start building a custom collection tailored to to your unique needs, goals, and budget.
Roberto Germán [00:01:06]:
Welcome back to Our Classroom. I'm your host, Roberto Germán, and I'm here with Lorena Germán, your best colleague ever.
Lorena Germán [00:01:15]:
Hello.
Roberto Germán [00:01:16]:
Hello, hello. How are you today?
Lorena Germán [00:01:19]:
I'm well. How are you?
Roberto Germán [00:01:20]:
I'm well. Thanks for being here.
Lorena Germán [00:01:22]:
Mm hmm.
Roberto Germán [00:01:23]:
Well, today we're talking about multilingual speakers in the US.
Lorena Germán [00:01:28]:
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Roberto Germán [00:01:30]:
Let's go ahead and jump in. How do you define bilingual education as a civil right? And what implications does this hold for educational policy and practice?
Lorena Germán [00:01:42]:
I mean, that question alone is a podcast.
Roberto Germán [00:01:45]:
Yes, but we're doing a podcast now.
Lorena Germán [00:01:48]:
So answer the question. Okay, that's a whole dif. Like, that's. Anyway, you're stalling. I'm sorry. It's just such a big question. Okay, but let me. Let me do it this way.
Lorena Germán [00:01:58]:
Historically, us education and us schools really have intentionally and proactively sought to silence other languages and make them secondary languages when English, to this day in 2024, is not the official language of the United States, even though it is kind of, like, understood to be so. So with that being said, we've had to then make it a civil right for people to be able to speak Spanish or to speak any other language. And so it's a civil right in that in schools, you legally should not be able to tell me not to speak my own language because we do not legally have a main language in the country. And so in today, what if we did?
Roberto Germán [00:02:49]:
What if we did?
Lorena Germán [00:02:50]:
That's a good question. But even if we did right, people should still be able to speak their own languages because they do not hinder learning. In fact, science and brain science specifically shows that knowing multiple languages is really good for the brain itself, like as a muscle, but as an organ. Right. But also. Or more so. And that learning new concepts in your home language or in your, you know, mother tongue is ideal for you to understand these new ideas. And so even if we did have a US main official legal language, if you will.
Lorena Germán [00:03:28]:
Right. For lack of, like, more official terms, that doesn't mean that we then shut out all other languages officially.
Roberto Germán [00:03:38]:
Hmm. Well, and I'm not, I'm not. I don't necessarily disagree. I'm just thinking.
Lorena Germán [00:03:48]:
It sounds like you disagree.
Roberto Germán [00:03:49]:
I don't. I don't disagree.
Lorena Germán [00:03:51]:
Fine.
Roberto Germán [00:03:54]:
But what are we saying exactly? Are we saying, like, students don't have to learn English?
Lorena Germán [00:04:02]:
No, no, no. I'm not saying that.
Roberto Germán [00:04:05]:
Were you saying they should be able to speak whatever language they.
Lorena Germán [00:04:08]:
I'm just saying that it doesn't have to be. Leave who you are at the door in order to succeed in here. Right. So if I, you know, we. We understand, culturally speaking, that in this nation, as it stands today, English is an important language to be able to speak in order to navigate society and do the things. Great. We also see that the English is a common language globally for a number of different reasons. And so just knowing this language is a tool for success.
Lorena Germán [00:04:36]:
Cool. But, like, that doesn't mean it's better than, for example, my mother tongue, which is Spanish. Well, originally it wasn't, but here we are. Right. And so Spanish shouldn't be secondary. No one should be at the store telling me speak English right. At school. I shouldn't be penalized for having Spanish, for knowing Spanish, for being able to speak it in the hallways or speak it with a peer in my classroom as I'm trying to understand something or just to talk.
Lorena Germán [00:05:02]:
Right. So that's it.
Roberto Germán [00:05:04]:
Again, I don't disagree. I just. I know. I've heard the argument, and I understand that because I think some folks, and there are numerous institutions that are not penalizing and not trying to penalize a student for knowing a second language, whether that language is Spanish or French or Creole, German, whatever the language is. But that folks would be like, well, I understand that. And this student is here. And in this context in the United States, you do need to learn English. You need to be able to master the english language for the reason you just said, to help you to navigate all of this and find success here.
Lorena Germán [00:05:47]:
And it does not have to be at the expense of your home language.
Roberto Germán [00:05:51]:
But again, I think there's a lot of folks who are not saying anything about it being at the expense.
Lorena Germán [00:05:56]:
Right. But the practices in schools are the ones that communicate that. So, for example, when you have teachers telling parents in early childhood, for example. Right. Oh, at home, I want you to practice English and speak English so that they can get it. That is how young people, little children, start to forget their home languages.
Roberto Germán [00:06:17]:
Yeah. There's a tension there, right? Cause the flip side of that is. Cause I look at that and say, all right, I wonder if what's happening there is the educator simply not communicating something well. You know, that there's a need that has to be addressed, and it's not being communicated well. And I'm using this as an example. Maybe the need is like, hey, how do we best support this child in developing their English proficiency? How do we best support this child being able to read, write, and comprehend English well? And maybe what they're trying to communicate is like, hey, it would be helpful, parent, guardian, family, if you would reinforce XYZ, you could support. And I think it's important for us to be able to look at the different angles and examine the tension in all of this, because I think a lot of folks are just wrestling with that, you know, like, hey, actually, I think it's great that you speak a second language, or third or whatever the.
Lorena Germán [00:07:35]:
Case, because that's their first language.
Roberto Germán [00:07:38]:
Yeah, yeah, that's what I meant.
Lorena Germán [00:07:39]:
Yeah.
Roberto Germán [00:07:40]:
And, hey, man, how are we gonna get you to where you need to be, especially knowing that next year you're moving on to another grade level, right. And that that's something that has to be acknowledged. Right?
Lorena Germán [00:07:58]:
Yeah. I mean, I think that there's other issues embedded in that. Like, for example, which I think is just whatever. It's very ideological. Right. That kids have to be at a certain level in. In this second language in order to do ABC. Right?
Roberto Germán [00:08:15]:
Well, no, no, no. Hold up. It's not just ideological. It's the reality.
Lorena Germán [00:08:20]:
Yes, that's because it's ideological, but it's the reality. Yeah. Based on an idea. Like. Like, I mean, we've talked about this, right? Like, who has determined some of these standards? Who said that a third grader needs to be able to do ABC? Right. And so, like, is it possible that that third grader learns ABC in fourth grade and they are perfectly fine and nothing is wrong with them and. Right, and so that's what I mean, that a lot of this is actually also ideological.
Roberto Germán [00:08:44]:
Yes.
Lorena Germán [00:08:45]:
But anyway, let's do it.
Roberto Germán [00:08:46]:
Some of it is ideological, but, you know, all of it is grounded in the reality that has to be confronted by students, families, educators.
Lorena Germán [00:08:57]:
Yeah.
Roberto Germán [00:08:58]:
Right. And so we have to be able to. So let me to lean into this in terms of, yes. Identifying what's ideological and oftentimes systemic issues and at the same time, offer people angles perspective on, like, all right, well, you know, and here are some concrete ways in which we can address this.
Lorena Germán [00:09:24]:
So, going back to the original point here, which is, like, you know, or the example that I raised of folks telling early childhood kids, or even older kids, not to speak Spanish at home with their parents, they're. I think your point is putting us in the right direction of, like, this. This could be a communication issue. Right. Although I do think that there are absolutely folks who. Who would believe that. Who do believe, like, just don't speak it right now.
Roberto Germán [00:09:53]:
Oh, yeah, right. Like, we know that's not. That's not the argument here.
Lorena Germán [00:09:57]:
No, but that is an issue, though.
Roberto Germán [00:09:59]:
Yeah, we know that.
Lorena Germán [00:10:01]:
Okay, so I want to address both.
Roberto Germán [00:10:04]:
You see, you.
Lorena Germán [00:10:05]:
You can't bring me. You can't bring me on a podcast and not let me just have my. What.
Roberto Germán [00:10:11]:
What are we doing still on question number one? That's what we're doing. Okay, listen, you done turn the first question into the whole podcast.
Lorena Germán [00:10:17]:
I told you that this could be its own podcast.
Roberto Germán [00:10:19]:
Now it's gonna be a six part series.
Lorena Germán [00:10:21]:
Hi, Santo. Listen to me.
Roberto Germán [00:10:24]:
Question number one of six.
Lorena Germán [00:10:25]:
Okay, but listen to me.
Roberto Germán [00:10:27]:
Go ahead.
Lorena Germán [00:10:28]:
Thank you. I think that there is something to be said for how these things are communicated, too. When I was in that position, having to support kids who were recent newcomers to the United States, whose first language was Spanish, but it really did whatever language I would communicate at home. Hey, continue. Nourish this language. You don't want your child to lose this language. And here are a couple of ways.
Roberto Germán [00:10:50]:
All right, so one strategy is, yeah, be very proactively communicate with the home people. Okay? So, boom, that's one strategy.
Lorena Germán [00:11:01]:
And be very specific.
Roberto Germán [00:11:03]:
Affirm their home language, their native language. Affirm the fact that they should continue embracing, practicing, engaging in their native language. All right, number three, now, go ahead.
Lorena Germán [00:11:17]:
The third strategy is to be very strategic with what you recommend for the home life. So, for example, say, you know, does this child like cartoons in English? All right, great. Make sure that they're watching one cartoon in English a day, or, you know, one day, like songs. All right, three songs, you know, in English a day or whatever, so that it's clear that this is about a strategy, not simply no more other language, only this new target language.
Roberto Germán [00:11:42]:
Yeah, I would. I would get more granular.
Lorena Germán [00:11:46]:
Sure. These are examples with a non existent kid.
Roberto Germán [00:11:49]:
Okay, well, you know, let's. Let's take that ideological kid and make.
Lorena Germán [00:11:55]:
I get it. That's fine.
Roberto Germán [00:11:56]:
I would say, like, depending on what we're working on, like, what. What are. What specific concepts are we working on. And then I, you know, within those cartoons, then, you know, try to, like, identify that, reinforce that, so forth. Or I might even offer, like, these specific. Well, we mentioned cartoons, so I'm rocking with that. But it might not be a cartoon. You know, name the thing.
Roberto Germán [00:12:25]:
Hey, you know, here's something that you listen to. Xyz, right? You know, that will help your child to become stronger in these concepts that we're working on or this, you know, bank of vocabulary that I need your child to have.
Lorena Germán [00:12:44]:
Mm hmm. We're ready to move on.
Roberto Germán [00:12:48]:
Oh, really? Really.
Lorena Germán [00:12:50]:
Go on.
Roberto Germán [00:12:51]:
Yeah. I don't know. Like, number two might be next week. Okay, this. This might be the whole episode number two.
Lorena Germán [00:12:59]:
Come on.
Roberto Germán [00:13:00]:
All right, since you're pressing me, and I actually, I knew I had one more thing to come back to. You know, since you wanted to start beefing with me, I just figured, like, you know, we'll go all the way.
Lorena Germán [00:13:13]:
Robert, I'll get to the point.
Roberto Germán [00:13:14]:
Well, no, like, you were talking so much that I lost it, okay?
Lorena Germán [00:13:18]:
Years ago. And me, bud, you know, I'm gonna expand.
Roberto Germán [00:13:21]:
Well, go ahead and expand on the impact of high stakes standardized testing on students of color learning a second language, and how does it contradict productive educational practices?
Lorena Germán [00:13:36]:
So, first I'd like to say hash abolishstandardized testing. Thank you. Repeat after me. You want to repeat it after me?
Roberto Germán [00:13:45]:
Hashtag abolished.
Lorena Germán [00:13:47]:
Standardized.
Roberto Germán [00:13:48]:
I'm like, I don't have to repeat anything after you. You know, I'm not even with standardized test. All right, so I was never a good test taker myself. I got, like, a 910 on my satisfaction. I got.
Lorena Germán [00:14:00]:
I don't remember what I got.
Roberto Germán [00:14:01]:
I forgot what I got on my gre, but it wasn't good. But here I am. I got a master's from Boston College. I turned out pretty well. Okay.
Lorena Germán [00:14:08]:
You a smart little cookie?
Roberto Germán [00:14:09]:
I am smart.
Lorena Germán [00:14:10]:
Cute, smart little cookie.
Roberto Germán [00:14:12]:
Where's hr?
Lorena Germán [00:14:13]:
Oh, my. Okay. Okay. So, high stakes standardized testing is actually part of the ideological problem that I was hinting at basically in the first question. These standardized tests are just ruining all the things, and they are especially difficult for our multilingual speakers and learners because they arrive here and they are just thrown to the wolves in this scheduling of testing, which. Which, in every way, it's a hustle, right?
Roberto Germán [00:14:43]:
And in every way, it's just that in itself, right? It's functional. Let's just say, like, all right, we left standardized testing, but like, that, especially that right there, that's never made sense.
Lorena Germán [00:14:53]:
To me at all.
Roberto Germán [00:14:54]:
Why are we testing kids who just arrived to this country one month ago, three months ago, six months ago, I.
Lorena Germán [00:14:59]:
Had a kid in my class who had arrived the day before, and I. You know, maybe. Maybe he was in there because there was nowhere else for him to go. That's very possible. But, I mean, okay, put him in there with a book. Give him a book. Give him a cover page. Like, what are we doing? But instead of, you have him sit there and take a test.
Lorena Germán [00:15:15]:
And I remember asking, does this child really have to be in here? And they're like, yeah, because of his grade. And I'm like, he literally arrived yesterday. And that, to me, is just like. I mean, borderline abuse, don't you think? Yeah, that's like. That's several hours in there. What is this kid gonna get out of that, other than feeling terrible that they have no idea what's going on?
Roberto Germán [00:15:35]:
Yeah, it feels abusive. It feels meaningless.
Lorena Germán [00:15:37]:
Oh, absolutely meaningless.
Roberto Germán [00:15:39]:
Harmful.
Lorena Germán [00:15:39]:
That's what I mean.
Roberto Germán [00:15:41]:
It feels.
Lorena Germán [00:15:42]:
Yeah, it's just terrible.
Roberto Germán [00:15:44]:
Just. It's a hustle.
Lorena Germán [00:15:46]:
It's a hustle. And, you know, it's never been about the kids. I know it was called no child left behind, but, no, you can't say it is absolutely about no business left behind.
Roberto Germán [00:15:54]:
Like putting students who are newcomers to this country and giving them a high stakes test in a language that they don't understand. Cause they just got here.
Lorena Germán [00:16:07]:
Right.
Roberto Germán [00:16:08]:
Makes any sense? Yeah, I'd love to sit down with the decision makers or people from department of Ed and, like, you know, make it make sense. Please tell me, show me what. What I'm missing that will actually makes. You'll be hard pressed to achieve that.
Lorena Germán [00:16:26]:
But gendered accessing has only brought us problems after all these years. You know what I mean? You look back, it's been problems after problems after problems.
Roberto Germán [00:16:35]:
So, anyways, let's. Let's build on the. That. The impact. The impact of, you know, one of the things I think about is how discouraging. How does it make. How do our students. How do our learners experience that? Right? What do.
Roberto Germán [00:16:54]:
What do they get from that? What type of impact does it have on their educational experience, on their motivation?
Lorena Germán [00:17:05]:
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Roberto Germán [00:17:06]:
You know, like, I could see. I know. Well, I've seen it. You know, as a school principal, I've witnessed how it's takes over. It has killed the motivation of many students.
Lorena Germán [00:17:21]:
Yeah.
Roberto Germán [00:17:22]:
You know, especially when they're doing, like, all right, you know, kids who score well, you know, there's incentives for the kids that do well, the classes that do well or whatever the case or, you know, you're getting a party if you're scoring in this range or this that or whatever. And I get. I understand the notion of incentivizing that people feel under pressure, and so you do those types of things like how. How was. How was that good? Like, and how is that helpful for the kids who have no shot of performing well on that because of, you know, the context of the situation? I'm not saying that with time and the right direction and them developing the skills that they can't ultimately perform well in the test, which, again, you know, there's still a lot of issues with that. Right. The notion of how we assess our children and the notion of high stakes testing. And it would be helpful to examine other models.
Lorena Germán [00:18:26]:
Yeah.
Roberto Germán [00:18:27]:
You know, like, from what I've read, they don't do it like this in Finland or just other countries.
Lorena Germán [00:18:34]:
I mean, there's.
Roberto Germán [00:18:35]:
That is another country.
Lorena Germán [00:18:36]:
I know, I know. I'm saying even other countries now.
Roberto Germán [00:18:40]:
There are no, but there's a reason I mention them, you know, that's like.
Lorena Germán [00:18:43]:
Right.
Roberto Germán [00:18:43]:
They're supposed to be.
Lorena Germán [00:18:44]:
There's differences between us and Finland.
Roberto Germán [00:18:47]:
Yeah. No, no, there's enormous differences. I mean, using that as an example. Right. One example, since they're viewed as, you know, top performing country academically when it comes to k twelve and whatnot and whatever, I've never been there. But, you know, our good friend, mentor, sister Dayna Benitez from teach with love global has. And she's shared her experience of what she's witnessed and thinks she's discussed with folks over there. And so, while it might not be apples to apples, there are certainly things that we can and should learn from what's happening in other educational systems around the country that the world.
Roberto Germán [00:19:40]:
That's what I meant. The world that would be applicable for us and perhaps improve what we are doing and ultimately improve the outcomes for students in the United States.
Lorena Germán [00:19:54]:
So I think in terms of the impact of standardized testing, there are two specific things I want to maybe expand on. One is standardized testing has greatly impacted the quality of life. So not just student morale, attitude and understanding of self. No, but like, actual concrete quality of life. This is how there are states where they need to pass this exam. Like, this is the case in Massachusetts, for example, in order to graduate. What is a kid supposed to do in the 2024 economy without a high school diploma because they didn't pass. This is going to impact.
Lorena Germán [00:20:35]:
Quality of life has already impacted quality of life. So there's that factor that we can't ignore. And then I also, I've been thinking about this a lot lately, and I've even mentioned it in a couple places, but I still need to think some more about it. But there is something to be said around how in this country, in our society, we equate good person with good student. So we have to think about how it is that a kid who is seen as a good student is also seen as a good kid. When a child or a student is doing well, caretakers or parents are often like, oh, yeah, such a good kid. You know, always does his homework. Such a good kid.
Lorena Germán [00:21:19]:
Straight A's at school. If something bad happens to a kid, I was such a good kid, you know, teacher always said he was such a good kid. We correlate goodness as a human with academic success. And so what does it mean that all of a sudden these standardized tests are being used to label my whole school, me as a part of this, right. As either underperforming or, you know, whatever the other needs improvement. Right. Like all these different labels that are getting attached to these kids and their schools. Funding is a tied to this also.
Lorena Germán [00:21:55]:
And so worthiness is tied to this. So we're really going deeper than simply saying, hey, this. This child needs some support in this area academically. These standardized tests are doing bigger, deeper work than just that.
Roberto Germán [00:22:14]:
Yeah, there's definitely ripple effects with all of this. And I think there needs to be more conversations about how we can assess students. And, you know, going to the labels. I don't like the labels, but I think one perspective that surfaces for me is there will probably be labels even if you remove the standardized testing, right?
Lorena Germán [00:22:51]:
Oh, yeah.
Roberto Germán [00:22:51]:
Because we gotta be able to call the spade a spade. Like, if students or, you know, I'll make it larger. A school is not performing well. Right. And I've been in all types of schools, high performance schools, low performance schools.
Lorena Germán [00:23:10]:
Yeah.
Roberto Germán [00:23:11]:
But we have to be able to, like, call a spade a spade. You know, if a school has a high percentage of students that are not doing well, then we should be able to acknowledge that for sure and get to the root of, like, why that is and then address that. Right? Come up with a plan to support, address those needs and move everybody forward.
Lorena Germán [00:23:42]:
That's just a separate issue because, like, standardized testing isn't telling us any of that. We already knew that. Because those issues that impact those schools.
Roberto Germán [00:23:51]:
Well, I don't see it as a separate issue because I'm not. Again, I'm not saying standardized testing. What I'm saying is like, we still have to be able to assess.
Lorena Germán [00:24:02]:
Yeah, of course.
Roberto Germán [00:24:04]:
Even if the assessment's different, but the outcomes are the same, then what's a whole different issue? Then what? Like, so not naming that or not having these labels is. That's not gonna change the reality. It's still gonna be the reality of the situation.
Lorena Germán [00:24:20]:
Yeah. Here's where I disagree. Like, if an assessment is supposed to show me what you know and what you don't know, then a student is not going to necessarily fail that because everybody knows something. And so assessments, like, I think we have to rethink what assessments are. Again, this is why I go back to. This is also very ideological. Right. Like, if we were to implement something like a portfolio style of assessment in schools or that just some more choice and flexibility, pun intended, in how these assessments are done and designed in schools and administered, I think we would get to see actual better data, more holistic data.
Roberto Germán [00:25:04]:
Yeah.
Lorena Germán [00:25:05]:
That's representative of truth.
Roberto Germán [00:25:07]:
Yeah, but there's no disagreement there. But again, what I'm saying is, like, if you did that, and fine with the whole. If we're looking at assessment is tell them. Tell me what you don't know. Right. I agree with that. And I'll reiterate what I state. If.
Roberto Germán [00:25:27]:
If I'm doing things differently and I'm still seeing, like, oh, you don't know all these things that you're supposed to do. You haven't mastered these skills. Like, that's still the reality that we have to confront.
Lorena Germán [00:25:40]:
Right. But I'm hopeful that that is not then tied to the school's funding. A teacher's evaluation of her job for a year. Who might get fired. Right. The student not being able to grab. Well, yeah, maybe they wouldn't graduate high school if they don't have certain skills, but that. It's not, like, the end of the road.
Lorena Germán [00:26:00]:
And now you. That's it.
Roberto Germán [00:26:02]:
No, not necessarily at the end of the road. But what if that teacher. What if there was the same outcome with the group the teacher had the year before? In the year before. In the year before, in the year. You got five years. Five years in a row for sure, where your students are not demonstrating any growth.
Lorena Germán [00:26:20]:
Sure.
Roberto Germán [00:26:20]:
Like, that's not. That's not a data point.
Lorena Germán [00:26:25]:
I don't think that.
Roberto Germán [00:26:26]:
I'm saying, like. I'm saying, like, again, I'm not saying based on standardized. We're just talking about assessment. Right. Yeah. No, we already dressed that well. We're. We're elaborating on the second question, you know, and you're stuck on the standardized testing.
Roberto Germán [00:26:45]:
I pivoted once. You say, like, once you started talking about, like, well, if we, you know, looked at assessed in a different way. Now I pivoted. No, no, no. Don't. Don't be you over here giving me signs and stuff. But now, now what I'm saying is we can't just, you know, push, push, push against standardized assessment, which, again, I don't even like and I'm not with, but then, you know, not have as much to say when we switch it up and we see, like, oh, wait a second, like, we're still not getting these outcomes. Why is that? Like, we have to dig deeper into, like, what's happening? And I'm not saying there's, like, a singular answer to that.
Roberto Germán [00:27:35]:
I don't think the. The singular answer would be like, oh, the teacher is the issue, fire the teacher. And I'm certainly not saying the kids are the issue or the homes. And I think these things are nuanced.
Lorena Germán [00:27:47]:
Correct. I am saying I am opposed to standardized testing no matter what. We can absolutely figure out another way to assess. Assessment is good.
Roberto Germán [00:27:57]:
So there should never be a standardized test. Like, even if it's not high stakes? Is that what you're saying?
Lorena Germán [00:28:03]:
Um.
Roberto Germán [00:28:06]:
Cause I disagree with that.
Lorena Germán [00:28:08]:
Let me think.
Roberto Germán [00:28:08]:
I. I, like.
Lorena Germán [00:28:10]:
I do.
Roberto Germán [00:28:11]:
So if we're talking about, like, varied approaches, right. We're talking about diversity and learning styles. Diversity of assessment, then how can we just say, like, well, throw this whole thing out.
Lorena Germán [00:28:21]:
No. As. Okay, okay, okay. Standardized testing as it exists right now, in terms of. They are mandated by the state, designed by people who don't know these students. Right? Like, owned by these companies, attached to all this funding as they work, is a no. Throw that out.
Roberto Germán [00:28:39]:
We're on the same page with that.
Lorena Germán [00:28:40]:
So assessment of all sorts, even a standardized test that a teacher might want to use for a particular class or whatever a school is, like, we're going to try this approach. I am fine with people innovating and trying new things. I don't have problems with that. My problem is that these standardized tests function as a one size fits all approach. You can't assess everybody the same way because everybody ain't the same. They're not learning the same or the same material.
Roberto Germán [00:29:01]:
Right.
Lorena Germán [00:29:02]:
So that's it.
Roberto Germán [00:29:04]:
Yeah. And by the way, I'm not even saying that I would be doing this standardized test if I was in the classroom.
Lorena Germán [00:29:12]:
You pro standardized test right now. You out here defending.
Roberto Germán [00:29:14]:
Nah, I'm pro maintaining a balanced perspective and looking at things from different angles and trying to understand, like, where there are moments where an educator might approach that that way. Like, there are moments where that might make sense.
Lorena Germán [00:29:30]:
Fine.
Roberto Germán [00:29:31]:
That's all. Golly, you know, if we gonna be about the people and varied and, you know, diversified in our approach, then, you know, that's what we gotta do. And we can't, you know, we cannot exclude standardized testing. All right, y'all, we got through two questions today, so this is gonna be the new series. Thanks for rocking with us. We appreciate y'all. Catch you on the next episode. Peace.
Lorena Germán [00:30:03]:
Bye.
Roberto Germán [00:30:05]:
As always, your engagement in Our Classroom is greatly appreciated. Be sure to subscribe, rate the show, and write a review. Finally, for resources to help you understand the intersection of race, bias, education, and society, go to multiculturalclassroom.com. Peace and love from your host, Roberto Germán.
